3 Parenting Roles that help you Communicate without shame and hurt with Special Guest Cynthia Klein

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parents I have a special guest on. Please welcome Cynthia Klein to the podcast. Cynthia is the author of Allied Parenting and owner of the company Bridges to Understanding. Today we're going to talk all things communication with our kiddos. So welcome to the show, Cynthia.

It's great to be here. Been doing this parent coaching stuff for what, 20 some years, 28 years? 28 years, yes. Yeah, you know a few things.

Yes. And so tell our listeners your story. What makes you so awesome? How you became a parenting coach?

Fill us in. What feeds you with coaching? It's great to be here. I love talking about parenting.

So I started out, I got my degree in child psychology, and then I went in to be an elementary school teacher because that was always my passion was to be an educator, not a therapist, which is why today I'm not a therapist. I am an educator which is a different mindset but I taught elementary school for a while and then it was just like it wasn't enough for me like I had this deep passion like I wanted to help families create you know more harmony in the home and so I actually left teaching and people are like you're crazy you know you've got you know tenure I said this isn't it isn't fulfilling me And so I ended up through I ended up getting married, having a daughter and then getting connected with doing parent education.

And and it's wonderful. So I've had training in numerous different programs. And then through working with parents and raising my daughter, I kind of developed what was important to me. I think that's the thing. Each parent educator has a kind of a different piece of the pie, you know, a different perspective based on their personality.

right and I like things structured and I'm very keyed into language usage so I wasn't close to my mother my father and they were raised born in the 20s they didn't even know how to connect so I think for me feeling that pain of not connected to my mother as a teenage girl was like really made this determination like I want to have a close relationship with a teenage daughter Like, but how do I do that? And you can have this, you know, this vision, but unless I had to learn the skills in order to create it.

So my daughter is now 33, married. She moved hundreds of miles away and she wants us to move down there. I'm still married, 35 years married. So that says something, right?

My married daughter wants me to come down and help when she has a kid. So yeah, absolutely something. So you succeeded, right? Yep. She wants me nearby. And it's not like it was an easy path for you. I mean, you, number one, you had to learn how to do this communication thing, mother, daughter, because you didn't learn it. It wasn't modeled to you growing up, but your experience wasn't, wasn't necessarily, you know, white picket fence either.

Yes. Yeah. My daughter had a traumatic thing happen in fifth grade. This one girl made a lie up about me and then turned all these good friends against her. And that was at a time she was, you know, when you're 10, you're like, who am I? And what do people think of me? And so that really devastated her belief about herself. She lost the connection with these good friends.

And so, and you know, my daughter knows I talk about this as she ended up doing a lot of risky behavior. So if you don't feel good about yourself, then you put yourself in harm's way. And so I've had to really learn how to love unconditionally, no matter what she was doing. And to learn that that's a learned skill. I think absolutely to learn how to think in ways that you can accept your child for whatever they're going through. And I've gotten many, many cards from my daughter over the years saying help. Thank you for being there for the mountains and the valleys, like through the ups and downs. So that's my real main expertise is communication. How do you listen?

And then when you give directions, how do you say it when it's where it doesn't shame and it doesn't hurt? Like parent, you don't listen all the time. There's times, you know, I made my, made my daughter clean the bathroom, made her empty the dishwasher, but I didn't use shaming and humiliation. So I really focus on the language and the impact of words on kids. Well, and I love that.

And that's, that's one of the reasons why I was excited to have you on is you're going to talk to us today about three parenting roles directly related to language and how we communicate with our kids. And, you know, one of the things that you said, I mean, put when our kids upset us, or they do something that embarrasses us, or that goes against our morals or our beliefs or our rules or whatever, we often get caught into the emotion of it.

And we turn it all, make it all about us. And we interject our own stuff in there that it's like, wait a second, let's, you're taking the focus off the child and the behavior that they did and you're putting it onto yourself. You're making it all about you, really, right? Yes.

So let's get into the three parenting roles. I'm just going to let you jump in and tell us a little bit about each three. Right. But I did want to say, I love what you just said, because we do become quite self-centered parents and they don't realize it.

Like, it's all about me. You've hurt me, you know, you know, so. But it is good, you know, for the listeners out there today, just think about those moments or those times when you have your kids caused a problem for you or someone else. and you've decided that you have to take control of it and you have to, you know, interject yourself in there and you have to tell them how to do this or why to do that, or, you know, like just take a minute to think of some of those, write them down and then listen to this episode because you're going to hear about three different parenting roles.

Yes. Yes. And they aren't styles. Sometimes people confuse it. They're roles that you're to play depending on who has ownership of solving the problem of whom is saying this is a problem and i want to solve it so that's how you decide what your role is so there's three roles um and i'll go briefly say them there you can be a director like you know you think of a director at a movie theater right gives out directions or at times you need to be a collaborator you come up with a joint solution together that's collaboration or there's time you need to be a supporter where you say this is my child's problem to solve it impacts them directly not me so I'm going to simply support them and I'm going to say to them you're going to make the decision so you know I'm not going to tell you what to do this and parents get very confused as to when you have to be the one to say,

okay, I'm gonna be a director. I'm setting a limit on how much that your cell phone is not gonna be in your room at night. This is my job. I'm a director right now because you don't see it as a problem, right?

Cell phone in the room, how can that be a problem? I see it as a problem. So as a parent, there's a value. I'm trying to keep them safe, healthy, not have a cell phone there.

So as your parent, I'm setting this rule. The cell phones will be out of the room 10 o'clock, 11, depending on how old your kid is. And when you make that statement, it is not a one of argument. It is not one of discussion.

And a lot of parents feel like, oh, if I discuss it with my child, and I laugh at this, and they agree that they, they agree, I'm doing air quotes, right? They agree that yes, they'll turn it in, that that it's going to make it easy for you. Parents, when you're a director, they're not going to like the rule you're setting. And it's okay.

They don't have to like it, right? They don't have to like it. So if you're a director, it's important to do it in caring ways, not flimsy ways. Not, would you please do this?

Or can you help me? No. All the parents I work with are strong-willed kids. My daughter was strong-willed.

So that's who I work with. It needs to be just very clearly stated. like my daughter would say, can I go to my friend's house? And I'd think, what hasn't she done yet? That's the thing. She's asking for something. What hasn't she done? Oh, she hasn't cleaned the bathroom yet. Okay. So I'd say after you clean the bathroom, then you can go. What do you mean? It's everybody's getting together now. Why do I have to do it now? Now I don't engage in the arguing. Very important as a director. After the bathroom, then you can go. But why didn't you remind me sooner. You waited to the last minute. Bathroom first. Yeah, it's just repeating. Very matter of fact, right? And notice how I did. I reduced the amount of words and I didn't argue.

And I always says the work before play. Don't say the play before the work. Parents think, oh, if I tell them the fun thing that they're going to get to do, like, yeah, you can go to your friend's house after you clean the bathroom. You know what they're going to hear? You can go to your friend's house. Right. So that's one of the director role strategies. Notice I didn't shame her. I didn't say, well, if you had done it sooner, it wouldn't be this problem.

You leave out all the shaming, blaming. You're simply respectful, stated clearly, and it works. So the after then is one of the director roles that works. Yeah. And not getting caught in that battle or engaging in the back and forth, you know, dialogue or, or, you know, interactions of well, you said I could and no, I didn't. And, you know, I told you, you needed to this that, you know, just less all of that. And you know, that it's where parents really get tripped up because they think, oh, I need to listen to my kid. I need to hear them express it. But I'm going to tell all of your listeners, when you're being a director, you're saying it's time to take out the trash or whatever that is not the time that you listen it's not the time you discuss so i'm taking you off the hook you don't do it then right plus you're also not saying no that they can't go to the friend's house you're actually saying yes you're saying hey yeah sure just as soon as the bathroom's clean yes right clean the bathroom go to the friends no done said done deal so that's the director and it's important to be clear that when you can be a director and it changes on every problem, what, you know, who's directing. The second thing is a collaborator.

So you're a collaborator in this, you're saying we're having, we are having a problem. We need to come together. Maybe it's the whole family and solve this problem because the problem is impacting everybody. One of the big things is chores. It impacts everybody. If the groceries aren't bought, who's going to eat? If the dishes aren't done, what are you going to eat off of, right? If the vacuum, so even when kids don't like it, it's still a joint family problem to solve.

So please don't say to your kids, would you help me empty the dishwasher? Wait a minute, are they your dishes your dishwasher no so i really teach parents how to come together and do problem solving there's a whole i have a whole five-step process on how to do collaborative problem solving um how you do that how you come together how you come with a plan um what's crucial whenever you come up with like okay who who's doing you know who's emptying the dishwasher who's cleaning the bathroom, who's dusting, whatever. You come up with a plan. What's crucial to know is you always say, let's try the plan for, let's say, a week. And we're going to come back together in one week from now, and we're going to see how the plan's working.

Because if you don't, all plans peter out. Okay? Determinations. And then the parents get mad.

You said you were going to do this. So make sure step five of my five steps is to come back and review it. So you do all this planning together. Please know when you make a plan, that's the easy part.

The follow through is a hard part. Right. So you may probably still have to do director roles to make sure there's follow through. And what I love about the collaborator and bringing everybody together and, you know, talking, especially when it comes to chores, you know, maybe curfews, schedule, things like that.

It's not about chores as much as it is family contributions. These are just the things that keep the household running that make everybody happier because, you know, the house is clean, it's picked up, you know, there's some sort of schedule to things. And then, you know, mom and dad are happy. Kids are happy. Laundry's done. Dish is done. There's food on the table, all that kind of stuff.

It's just basic family contributions. And it's teaching. Very important to teach that when you're part of a community that you contribute. So maybe they're going to be off in college and they're sharing a dorm room.

Maybe I mean, my daughter would talk about her roommates like just leaving the dishes around. So the training needs to happen when they're at home that they take the dishes over. They're not going to please don't put home. Don't say can't.

Oh, they're too busy with homework. They can't do chores. No, they must learn how to contribute to the household and to contribute. That's a life skill.

Right. Or so than homework. I'm sorry to tell you, but do I think kids actually do better when they have that structure and that they're contributing to the family. That actually does a lot more for their self-esteem and self-regard as well.

So, okay. So we've got director, collaborator, and then? Supporter. So, and this can be hard for parents to be a supporter.

A supporter is when your child has a problem that directly impacts them and no rules are being broken. There's no safety issues. and it's an opportunity for them to use their prefrontal cortex reasoning logic part of the brain and to come up with solutions so a lot of times friendships are in that category of where you're being a supportive role if you have a like a teenager like you have one now who's going to be a senior maybe you're going to say i'm going to let you totally pick your classes So that would be, then you're saying clearly, I'm going to be a supporter role.

When you're a supporter, you don't say, well, I think you should. No, you don't do any of that. You may not even offer ideas. You might just say, you might just be a sounding board for them to talk about things.

Because I'll tell you, I think that's so important to be a parent that doesn't use communication blocks that doesn't give unwanted advice, that doesn't interrogate, because I work with a lot of parents who have done the blocks and I'm helping them undo it. When kids learn, like, whenever things are really hard, they can come to you and you're not going to shut them down and you're going to listen to them vent in their emotional stuff, because you know that by them talking, it lets their emotions out and then it lets them think better and they have more clarity just your being there gives them an amazing feeling of unconditional love and i had to go through that many times with my daughter of of just being there for her because she didn't want me to tell her what to do right to this day strong will kids don't want you to tell them what to do when she got married she didn't call up and say mom what do you think i should do no it was more like, mom, here's what you can do for me. So please learn how to be a supporter because when you're a supporter, when you know how to listen, and I know you talk a lot about listening and how to listen in a way that feels caring and supportive. Then when you have to be a director,

then they take it much better. Yeah. That relationship first, not always telling them what to do, how to do it, what they did wrong, what they could have done different, what they I mean, who wants to listen to that all day? And what kid is going to come to you for advice or solutions or to even vent to you if that's the communication that you're having with them?

So the supporter role is very important. And we don't always need to be rescuing our kids from their problems. We can ask them, well, what do you think you're going to do? Would you like some advice?

But don't offer it freely. Yeah. And I think what I also encourage parents to do is to say, we can say, let's, we can think of some potential ideas. Because when you ask somebody what they're going to do, often they'll say, I don't know, because they haven't gone through the process of thinking about possibilities.

So your role as a supporter could be, well, let's say they're trying to decide what college to go to, or the older one. Well, let's throw around some ideas, let's, we could think about pros and cons of the different colleges, and then it will help you come up with a decision, or a friendship issue. you know, rather than you jumping in and saying, well, when I was your age, this happened to me, and this is what I did. I wouldn't even recommend that unless they have asked for it.

Like, I had a similar experience. Would you like to hear about it? If they say no, don't be offended. Just say it. They want to focus on themselves, not on you.

Absolutely. You talk about some of the ways that parents are responding to their kids' thoughts or feelings that are causing mistrust. What are some of those things? So I call them communication blocks.

So if your child is expressing some thoughts or feelings and you're kind of shutting them down, I'm going to give you a recent example. just happened. One of my private coaching clients was telling me she's going to New York with her daughter. They're spending a week away. And they went to go to the shoe store. For some reason, her daughter said, I don't want to be here. And the mother wrote this out for me. So this is what I do. I have right out the dialogue as though you're writing a play. What happened? And as we're going through it, her daughter said, I don't want to be here. Well, we need to have shoes. Remember, we said we're going to come and have shoes. Let's leave. I don't want to be here. And her mother,

the mother kept going on and on every time to say why she needed shoes. No acknowledgement. She never even said, oh, why is that? She was so much on her agenda. This is what we need to do.

So her mother had an agenda as well. But it's like, if talking about yourself, being a me too-ism can really shut down kids. It makes them feel like it's more important for you to talk than for me. Interrogating.

Wow, a child said, you know, I'm really having a hard time with my friend. And you start saying, well, what happened? You know, or what did you do? Or tell me more.

Even those questions, it can have an underlying message of, you've done something wrong or I need to fix it. So I really encourage parents to not like really go into questions if you see that shutting your kid down. Right. So if a kid, that's a great, that's a great example to use.

If your kid says, I don't have any friends, what do you say? Wow, that's, that's, that's hard. That sounds like a real challenge. Exactly. I love that. Instead of going into fix it mode, right?

Yes. So I think of it as I term it as empathy phrases where when there's expression, like you said about no friends, is you give you just let the child know that you're there to let them keep venting about it because they're in an emotional state. And we want to help them get to the point of possibly solving the problem, right? That's your, as a parent, oh my God, they've got to have more friends, but we need to give them space first to really feel like they're heard and that we're not jumping in and fixing it.

And isn't that hard? I mean, I've been through a lot with my daughter, so I've had lots of experience of not jumping in. And so that's where you have to believe in your kids. Right.

No, I love this because a lot of times our gut reaction, our instant response when our kids say we don't have any friends is to say, oh, sure you do. And you start naming these kids. But that's where the mistrust comes in in a couple of ways. Parents trying to convince their kids that they have friends is a no-no.

Yeah. And I call that placating. And my list of 10 communication blocks, placating. So this is perfect.

We're in perfect unison here. Yeah. So instead, just listening, that has to be hard. That's an empathetic statement.

And then, you know, I talk a lot about in step three of my no problem parenting, changing the conversation. And this is, this is why this is so great today that, that we are having this conversation because I really believe we are giving our kids way too much unconditional praise so much. So they don't believe the praise that we're giving them. So when we tell them, oh yes, you have friends and we try, you know, to convince them that they do, or they say, you know, I don't look good. I'm not popular. I I'm not good at that, the sport or whatever. We try to rescue that instead of just saying, wow, that's gotta be really hard. Yeah. They need to learn how to handle life. Yeah. And they need to be able to feel a certain way without us coming in and rescuing it. Now, of course, we're going to give them some ideas if they're open for it, or we're going to have that communication with them.

uh we're going to open the door to say hey i'm here for you if you need to vent or you need you you know you want to talk to me about that right yes yeah but we're not going to just automatically go in and and rescue them because i think then it also shows um tell some kids that we're not believable and that uh and that does create mistrust right so let's give them some conditional positive, some conditional praise, believable, factual stuff before we're pouring on the unconditional and definitely not convincing them that they're better at something than they think they are. And, you know, I also think of when I think of unconditional love, which you're talking about praise is, is loving your child for whoever they are and to not let your own negativity get in the way your own fears, parents are ruled often by fears, our own fears, be careful about not putting that on your child and believe in them. Because when they're not believing in themselves,

and you believe in them, and it's not through placating, you know, like, oh, you're wonderful, that doesn't work. But, you know, the sense of I'm here for you. And like, I know you can solve this problem, that kind of feeling, and you're not a bad person. That's important for kids to know that you're always going to be there for them. You're not going to, well, if you hadn't done that, or that was a ridiculous thing to do, or why didn't you do it my way? If you don't do it my way, then, well, you're on your own because kids hear that as well. Absolutely. Well, before we wrap up, I do want to talk about your book, Ally Parenting. And I guess I have a question about that too.

What does it mean to be an ally parent versus an adversary to your child? Yeah. So an ally is one of the things that ally does is they put the relationship as important and they think of the relationship, the long-term relationship. Like, what am I doing now?

That's what is it doing to the relationship? Like anything you're doing. I think that's really important. and that emotions are heard when it's appropriate, not when you're being a director.

And that parents really focus on changing themselves first rather than seeing their child as the problem. So when there's a problem, rather than saying you need to change, you're the problem, what parents say, what can I do differently? And then that really helps the kids to not feel like they're the problem. Like in other words, you're kind of on their side, doesn't mean you say yes all the time. An ally says no, but as an ally, your kids know that they can rely on you, that you'll be there for them when they've messed up, when things are bad.

And I had my daughter, you know, many times mess up, but because she knew I was there for her as her ally. Whereas an adversary doesn't, they just think short-term, right now I've got to get my kids to do their homework. Right now I've got to, you know, they've got to learn that they can't talk to me like that. And they don't think about the relationship. They think very short term emotions aren't that important. And many parents have been raised with an adversarial parent because that's how it's always been. Trying to be an ally is pretty new, last 50 years or so.

Yeah, right. And adversaries are more reactionary. I see allies as more thoughtful. Yeah, I love that. Yeah. Thinking ahead of time. What are the issues that are going to come up?

Being proactive also in thinking about the, you know, the potential problems and how can you proactively kind of try to diminish those problems also before they arise. Right. So you have a free download for us today. The seven common phrases that cause children not to listen.

So it's going to keep them engaged versus tuning them out. Yes, yes. Because we have to stop what we're doing that isn't working first. Even if you are not doing well at listening well, if you can stop what you're doing that's causing problems, that'll make a huge shift.

So tell us how we can get in contact with you, learn more about you, get your book and find your resources. Yeah, great. I think it's easy if you think of going to ally, A-L-L-Y, allyparenting.com.

That will take you to my website. It'll let you know about my book. You can find my book on any bookseller. I'm really here to support parents.

I work with parents that are ages five to 25. I don't work with parents with the little kids. I do the five to 25, all the way up to young adults. and do a lot of speaking.

I used to do a lot of in-person speaking. I haven't done that in a couple of years, but a lot of one-on-one coaching. And then I also have a free class that I give every month. So if you go to allyparenting.com, you can sign up for my newsletter.

Awesome, that's super great. You're also on Facebook, LinkedIn, and YouTube, and I'm gonna have all the links in the show notes. So it'll make it really easy for parents to click on the information and go find your free resources and also learn how they can do coaching with you. Much like me, you're doing virtual sessions.

It's so nice, parents, because if you're a two-parent home and you're working in different locations, you can log in from separate locations, get it done during the day, not have to drive to another appointment. That is my favorite thing about what I do. And they're quick. They're more focused.

We're not worried about like meet the dog and have a drink of water and all those other things. It's like, let's get to a solution right away. So, well, you've been a joy to have on the podcast, Cynthia. I appreciate it.

We're going to make sure to have your resources on our new resource page at noproblemparents.com backslash resources. You guys can go check Cynthia out there as well. Do you have one parting message that you can send our parents listening today?

Think about how you're thinking about your children. Like really take time. Do you see them as the problem or do you see them as part of the solution? Then you can work together to solve the issues that are going on.

That's really good. Awesome. I love it. Well, thanks so much for being a guest today, Cynthia.

It's been wonderful. Thanks, Jackie. Thank you for tuning in to the No Problem Parenting podcast. Join Jackie next time for more tips, tools, and resources that will help you become the confident leader your kids crave you to be. Who do you know that we could support on their parenting journey? Like this podcast, subscribe, share, or leave a review of the show. Your support of the No Problem Parenting podcast pays it forward and helps us help more families.

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